The Amanda Fucking Palmer Kickstarter debate

[the idiot]

Well, that discussion is beyond the scope of my interest. But I must say that of the many adjectives that might be used to describe Amanda Palmer, "hippy-dippy" would never make my list.

The blog post strikes me that way--it's this egoism masquerading as a plea for approval: I'm okay because I've touched you all in such a meaningful way! And you're okay because you're my fans! Lou Reed knows he's great and will tell you as much, but he doesn't give a shit if you don't like him.

[AC]

The blog post strikes me that way--it's this egoism masquerading as a plea for approval: I'm okay because I've touched you all in such a meaningful way! And you're okay because you're my fans! Lou Reed knows he's great and will tell you as much, but he doesn't give a shit if you don't like him.

Let me just say this: I'm pretty certain that if you spent a few hours with Amanda, you would find that she has a lot more in common with Lou than you might suspect.

[the idiot]

Let me just say this: I'm pretty certain that if you spent a few hours with Amanda, you would find that she has a lot more in common with Lou that you might suspect.

Oh, I don't doubt it. And honestly, it's sort of silly to argue about types of egoism, but you brought it up as saying it's part of who she is. She doesn't strike me as all that smart about any of this. But part of that is my own egoism as a music fan.

[the idiot]

At least not smart in a way that I find admirable, inspiring or fun.

[AC]

Oh, I don't doubt it. And honestly, it's sort of silly to argue about types of egoism, but you brought it up as saying it's part of who she is. She doesn't strike me as all that smart about any of this. But part of that is my own egoism as a music fan.

Hmmm...I agree that it's silly to argue about types of egoism, but I thought you brought that up.

I do say that her ego and her attitude is a part of who she is. It's a part of who everyone is....

and, in her case, it helps her to be successful with her fans in what she does.

[the idiot]

Yeah, I get it. At this point I'm just babbling to avoid work. But I guess what rubs me so wrong about that blog post, which other people found touching because they relate to different parts of it, is she's cashing in on the fan relationship. She's using a personal comment from a fan who was moved by her work to promote herself--and I think that very much cheapens the connections that can be made between artists and fans/viewers, et. al., the very connections that she says she's championing. I think it's also at the heart of why getting local musicians to play for free was distasteful to so many people: she's cashing in on that emotional currency. It's gross. I get that a lot of fans don't mind and some people are thrilled to be a part of her "big noise," but it's still exploitative and it uses that fan's enthusiasm for profit.

I also get that the exploitation goes both ways, most obviously in the large-scale theft of music that goes on. But I still find it gross.

It reminds me of quote from Lester Bangs in Psychotic Reactions, where he says, (I paraphrase): Don't read authors who don't respect you.

[binR Bishop]

Feels GOOD to say CUNT, don't it? Where is Jack Frost, the all-over-it defender of The Word Cunt, Because the British Say It, So It Must Be OK? It's an offensive, degrading, violent fucking word, and I don't care or know anything about Amanda Palmer, but can we please give this word a rest and stop making pithy excuses for it? If you want to say CUNT, say it cuz you hate bitchez. But don't pretend there's a good use for it. There isn't. Say it cuz you hate. If you don't hate, don't say it. Thanks.

And don't give me any of that "But the Vagina Monologues" empowerment shit. That's the worst women's play of the 20th century. I despise it.

EDIT: Asshole.

I'm just now reading this thread, but what Hilde said. Several milion times over.

[AC]

I'm just now reading this thread, but what Hilde said. Several milion times over.

YES! And that was a large part of what originally pulled me into this thread as well.

[AC]

Yeah, I get it. At this point I'm just babbling to avoid work. But I guess what rubs me so wrong about that blog post, which other people found touching because they relate to different parts of it, is she's cashing in on the fan relationship. She's using a personal comment from a fan who was moved by her work to promote herself--and I think that very much cheapens the connections that can be made between artists and fans/viewers, et. al., the very connections that she says she's championing. I think it's also at the heart of why getting local musicians to play for free was distasteful to so many people: she's cashing in on that emotional currency. It's gross. I get that a lot of fans don't mind and some people are thrilled to be a part of her "big noise," but it's still exploitative and it uses that fan's enthusiasm for profit.

I also get that the exploitation goes both ways, most obviously in the large-scale theft of music that goes on. But I still find it gross.

It reminds me of quote from Lester Bangs in Psychotic Reactions, where he says, (I paraphrase): Don't read authors who don't respect you.

All artists who make a living on their art are cashing in on their fan relationships, in one way or another. They are all using their fans' enthusiasm for profit. That's the way it works.

And...(and I really don't mean this in the snotty way that it might sound)...it doesn't really matter what YOU think. It doesn't matter what I think either. We're on the outside of this looking in. The new paradigm enables Amanda Palmer to establish a direct relationship with her fans. The ones who want to participate choose to participate, and it's up to them to mediate the terms of the relationship and to decide if they're getting what they want out of the relationship. You may find how it works to be icky or distasteful or inauthentic or cheesy or hippy-dippy or whatever...but so what? It's not about you.

That's the lesson for artists here. It's about their ability to connect and engage their fans directly. It's about focusing on those who "get it" and nurturing that connection...rather than wasting time and energy on those who don't "get it" and never will.

[the idiot]

...it doesn't really matter what YOU think.

No arguments there...